what coach/player do the bulls need

hey, let me say, it wasn't jordan/paxson who drafted sam bowie ahead of jordan/barkley.. or trade kobe bryant for vlade divac (not that divac was at all bad) or draft stromile swift.. or draft pervis ellison as #1 draft pick in 89, or olowokandi in 1998.. or trade dirk nowitzki draft night for robert traylor, or Tskitishvilli at number 5 in 2000..

let's just sit on that for a bit..

Actually can I also say, nor did these guys have hire I Thomas as coach, and have him declare he wont trade lee/filler for artest and/or bibby, but he'll trade balkman for him/them.. WTF MAN..

for the record, how many times has paxson made playoffs as GM than Jordan/Thomas combined??

If you want to look at draft greatness, check out Kevin Sheedy drafting James Hird with pick 79 in 1990.. what's that roughly, approx. round 4?

Couple of things...

1. Kobe Bryant refused to play for any team other than the lakers, the hornets had no choice but to trade him
2. Stromile Swift was taken #2 in the WEAKEST draft ever...there were 2 all-stars in that draft, REdd and Jamaal Magloire...so taking Swift wasnt that big a deal
3. The Trade of Nowitzki for Traylor wasnt a bungle...The bucks either made the trade and ended up with a few extra $$$ or the Mavs just took Dirk themselves
4. Tskitsivilli was 2002


So none of those moves were that bad by the respective GM's
 
how is #3 not a strong enough case? Milwaukee could never have gotten Dirk

Dallas drafted Traylor #6 for Milwaukee for Dirk + Cash, if that deal didnt go down, then Dallas drafts Dirk #6
 
So none of those moves were that bad by the respective GM's

I agree. The reason Portland drafted Bowie instead of Jordan was because they already had Clyde Drexler:thumbsup:.Imagine how cool it would have been to see Drexler and Jordan paired together, 2 of the greatest Guards the league has ever seen. They would had brought instant championships to the city of Portland.:D

Jordan might have made one mistake while GM of the Wizards. But uou guys have to understand he was still learning at that stage. ....He did come back to to play for the Wizards so that showed how determined he was to help the Wizards franchise.Given more time to prove his worth, Jordan would have made a great GM in Washington.
 
OK well lets look at the roster that Jordan had prior to his taking the honcho position for the Bulls and the one he went into the first season with -

1998-99 Roster

Mitch Richmond 33 50 38.2 6.6 16.1 1.4 4.4 5.0 5.9 0.6 2.8 3.4 2.4 1.3 0.2 2.7 2.4 19.7
Juwan Howard 25 36 39.7 7.9 16.8 0.0 0.1 3.1 4.1 2.5 5.6 8.1 3.0 1.2 0.4 2.6 3.6 18.9
Rod Strickland 32 44 37.1 5.7 13.7 0.3 1.0 4.0 5.4 1.3 3.5 4.8 9.9 1.7 0.1 3.2 2.1 15.7
Otis Thorpe 36 49 31.4 4.9 9.0 0.0 0.0 1.5 2.2 2.0 4.9 6.8 2.1 0.9 0.4 1.8 4.0 11.3
Calbert Cheaney 27 50 25.3 3.4 8.3 0.2 0.7 0.7 1.3 0.7 2.2 2.8 1.5 0.8 0.3 0.8 2.9 7.7
Tracy Murray 27 36 18.1 2.3 6.6 0.9 2.9 0.9 1.2 0.5 1.8 2.3 0.8 0.6 0.2 0.8 1.8 6.5
Ben Wallace 24 46 26.8 2.5 4.3 0.0 0.0 1.0 2.9 3.0 5.4 8.3 0.4 1.1 2.0 0.8 2.4 6.0
Chris Whitney 27 39 11.3 1.6 4.0 0.8 2.4 0.7 0.8 0.2 1.0 1.2 1.8 0.5 0.1 0.9 1.3 4.8
Randell Jackson 23 27 10.0 1.7 4.0 0.0 0.3 0.8 1.2 1.1 0.9 2.0 0.3 0.1 0.4 1.0 1.1 4.2
Tim Legler 32 30 12.6 1.7 3.8 0.5 1.2 0.1 0.2 0.3 1.1 1.3 0.7 0.1 0.1 0.5 1.4 4.0
Jeff McInnis 24 35 12.2 1.4 3.8 0.3 1.0 0.6 0.8 0.3 0.3 0.6 2.1 0.5 0.0 0.9 1.0 3.7
Terry Davis 31 37 15.6 1.3 2.5 0.0 0.0 0.8 1.0 1.4 2.4 3.8 0.3 0.3 0.1 0.4 2.1 3.4
Jahidi White 22 20 9.6 0.9 1.6 0.0 0.0 0.8 1.8 1.2 1.8 2.9 0.1 0.2 0.6 0.6 2.0 2.5
John Coker 27 14 7.0 0.9 2.2 0.0 0.0 0.4 0.4 0.5 1.1 1.6 0.0 0.1 0.1 1.1 1.2 2.2
Etdrick Bohannon 25 2 2.0 0.0 0.0 0.0 0.0 0.0 0.0 0.0 0.0 0.0 0.0 0.0 0.0 1.0 0.0 0.0


This was the roster Michael Jordan inherited when taking over the reins of the Washington Wizards.



And this was the roster he left the Wizards with after playing his final season under Doug Collins.

Name Ag G MP FG FGA 3P 3PA FT FTA ORB DRB TRB AST STL BLK TO PF PTS
+--------------------+---+--+----+----+----+---+----+----+----+----+----+----+----+---+---+---+---+----+
Jerry Stackhouse 28 70 39.3 7.0 17.2 1.0 3.5 6.5 7.4 0.9 2.8 3.7 4.5 0.9 0.4 2.8 1.9 21.5
Michael Jordan 39 82 37.0 8.3 18.6 0.2 0.7 3.2 4.0 0.9 5.2 6.1 3.8 1.5 0.5 2.1 2.1 20.0
Larry Hughes 24 67 31.9 5.2 11.1 0.4 1.2 2.0 2.8 1.0 3.6 4.6 3.1 1.3 0.4 2.0 2.2 12.8
Tyronn Lue 25 75 26.5 3.3 7.6 0.8 2.3 1.2 1.4 0.3 1.7 2.0 3.5 0.6 0.0 1.0 2.0 8.6
Christian Laettner 33 76 29.2 3.4 6.8 0.0 0.2 1.6 1.9 1.5 5.1 6.6 3.1 1.1 0.5 1.1 2.7 8.3
Kwame Brown 20 80 22.2 2.8 6.3 0.0 0.0 1.8 2.7 1.6 3.7 5.3 0.7 0.6 1.0 1.4 2.0 7.4
Juan Dixon 24 42 15.4 2.5 6.5 0.6 2.0 0.9 1.1 0.3 1.4 1.7 1.0 0.6 0.1 1.0 1.3 6.4
Brendan Haywood 23 81 23.8 2.1 4.2 0.0 0.0 1.9 3.0 2.4 2.6 5.0 0.4 0.4 1.5 0.8 2.8 6.2
Etan Thomas 24 38 13.5 1.6 3.3 0.0 0.0 1.6 2.5 1.8 2.5 4.3 0.1 0.2 0.6 0.9 1.7 4.8
Bryon Russell 32 70 19.8 1.5 4.4 0.7 2.0 0.8 1.0 0.6 2.4 3.0 1.0 1.0 0.1 0.8 1.9 4.5
Jahidi White 26 16 14.4 1.6 3.3 0.0 0.0 1.1 1.6 2.3 2.3 4.6 0.1 0.1 0.8 0.6 2.1 4.2
Jared Jeffries 21 20 14.6 1.5 3.2 0.2 0.3 0.8 1.5 1.3 1.6 2.9 0.8 0.4 0.3 1.1 1.4 4.0
Bobby Simmons 22 35 10.8 1.3 3.2 0.0 0.1 0.9 1.0 0.9 1.3 2.2 0.6 0.3 0.1 0.2 1.5 3.4
Anthony Goldwire 31 5 6.8 0.8 1.4 0.2 0.2 0.8 1.0 0.0 0.6 0.6 0.2 0.0 0.0 0.8 0.2 2.6
Charles Oakley 39 42 12.2 0.5 1.3 0.0 0.0 0.7 0.8 0.9 1.7 2.5 1.0 0.3 0.1 0.5 2.1 1.8
Brian Cardinal 25 5 3.0 0.2 0.8 0.0 0.2 0.4 0.4 0.6 0.4 1.0 0.2 0.0 0.0 0.2 0.0 0.8




I think it fairly easy to work out he had a better roster when he started compared to when he departed the organization, and whilst he was playing i am sure he wielded considerable influence on the make-up of roster, especially when the front office was littered with Jordan buddies - Darrell Walker, Rod Higgens and even the coach Doug Collins.

And here is a brief history of Jordan's resume filler on his personnel moves whilst heading the organization -

2002-2003 Offseason Transactions

10/24/02 Wizards trade G Chris Whitney to the Denver Nuggets for G/F George McCloud and $500,000 cash.

10/15/02 Wizards sign F Charles Oakley to a one year, $1 million contract.

10/12/02 Wizards release G/F Rod Grizzard.

9/17/02 Wizards sign Patrick Ewing as assistant coach.

9/11/02 Wizards trade G Richard Hamilton, G Hubert Davis, and F Bobby Simmons to the Detroit Pistons for G Jerry Stackhouse, F Brian Cardinal, and C Ratko Varda.

9/10/02 Wizards sign F Bryon Russell to a two year, $2.9 million contract. The second year is a team option.

7/18/02 Wizards sign G Larry Hughes to a three year, $15 million contract.

6/26/02 Wizards select F Jared Jeffries from Indiana University with the #11 pick of the first round.
Wizards select G Juan Dixon from the University of Maryland with the #17 of the first round.
Wizards select Rod Grizzard from the University of Alabama with the #39 pick of the second round.
Wizards select Juan Carlos Navarro from Spain with the #40 pick of the second round.

6/21/02 Wizards trade G Courtney Alexander to the Charlotte Hornets for the #17 pick in the 2002 draft.

2001-2002 Season Transactions

11/08/01 Wizards release Loy Vaught. Loy Vaught retires.

2001-2002 Offseason Transactions

10/14/01 Wizards release SF Mike Smith

9/18/01 Wizards sign SG/SF Michael Jordan to two year contract at veteran minimum: 2 years, $2million.

8/1/01 Wizards trade Laron Profit and a conditional 1st round pick for center Brendan Haywood (taken 20th in 2001 NBA Draft) The Magic can take Washington's draft pick beginning in 2004, but the Wizards can keep the pick if it is among the first 20. The next season, it is protected through No. 13, and in 2006 it is protected only through the first three spots. If Orlando waits until 2007, the pick would be unconditional.

7/26/01 Wizards resign Popeye Jones to one year deal

7/18/01 Wizards resign Christian Laettner to four year, $21 million deal and sign FA Tyronn Lue to two year, $4 million deal. (Terrible decision on Laettner who had demonstrated he was not worth investing that much money into)

6/30/01 Wizards exercise Mitch Richmond’s buyout of $10 million (Buys out a player who goes 16/3/3 on a 20 odd win team....mmm not enough room in the backcourt for both me and him...must a been the view of His Airness)

6/24/01 Wizards draft Kwame Brown #1 in the Draft
Wizards trade the rights to Predrag Drobnak to Seattle for the right to 2nd round pick Bobby Simmons ( Well Brown decision speaks for itself no matter what spin is placed on it....and well long term i rated Simmons a better option then Drobo even though Simmons output had wained in recent seasons)

5/01 Wizards name Doug Collins head coach (Retreads his own former coach in place of one of the worst coaching appointments of all time - signing Hamailton, closely followed by jobs for the boys appointee Bill Hanzlik when Bristow ran the Nuggets)

5/01 Wizards fire head coach Leonard Hamilton (Good decision)

2000 – 2001 Season Transactions

Wizards release Rod Strickland after negotiated buyout (Effectively replaced Strickland who had numbers to the effect of 12/7/3 to allow Whitney to be the point man with numbers of 9/4/2 and who had been a life-long back up,and who was 3 years Strickland's junior)

Wizards trade PF Juwan Howard and C Calvin Booth to the Dallas Mavericks for PF/C Loy Vaught, PF Christian Laettner, SG Hubert Davis, PF Etan Thomas & SG Courtney Alexander. Wizards release Gerard King and Felipe Lopez.(Traded away servicable big man Juwan Howard and back-up big man Calvin Booth for Loy Vaught -14 games for the Wiz, Laettner who managed 3 1/2 less then inspiring seasons, outside shooter Hubert Davis who played 66 games and about 2 1/2 seasons more in the NBA, Courtney Alexander played 70 odd games for Wizards before being moved to the Hornets for effectively Juan Dixon with a 2002 draft pick who was a semi-decent 2 guard and Etan Thomas life time back up who has never played over 25 minutes per game...Howard has had another 7 productive seasons with decent numbers throughout, whilst nowhere near the offer tendered years ago by Miami, however he has always been a solid veteran prescence with output of around 15/6 per game, and Booth managed in the next two seasons kick-on with a nice back up role in Dallas and Seattle...but also was never worth the contract he got either....winner on this deal the Mavs..imo)

Wizards trade C Cherokee Parks and PF/C Obinna Ekezie to the Los Angeles Clippers for SG/SF Tyrone Nesby (Ekezie's feet barely touched the ground after being shipped in from Vancouver, another hi and good bye stop over for the over rated white stiff Mr Parks previously acquired by Jordan...Mr Nesby had a season and a bit in the capital before being jettisoned, and had more fame as an owner of basketball franchise in the minor league basketball world known as the ABA in North America)

2000 - 2001 Offseason Transactions

Wizards release PF/C Lorenzo Williams[/b] Aging and well past his potentially defensive best when acquired by the Wiz, however his per 40 minute output numbers were solid and on a team ranked as they were defensively his prescence on the court would've done no harm in my opinion)[/b]

Wizards trade C Ike Austin to the Vancouver Grizzlies for SF/SG Felipe Lopez, SG Dennis Scott, PF/C Obinna Ekezie, and C Cherokee Parks(Moving Austin and his over inflated contract, was possibly a good move considering on nice run in Miami was what earned him that huge deal originally...however the scrubs acquired are barely worth mentioning, Scott was past it, Lopez is likely unkown to even the most knowledgable hoops follower and well parks and Ekezie refer above)

Wizards trade SF Tracey Murray to the Denver Nuggets for PF/C Popeye Jones and 2002 2nd round pick ( I personally liked Murray from his Portland days, and he had a nice season in Toronto, as well as average output in DC, however acquiring the offensively average Jones, who had some mediocre seasons in Denver and Boston was especially when Howard, Laettner, White, vaught and Booth were on the roster at various times)

Wizards resign C Jahidi White and PG Chris Whitney

Wizards draft Mike Smith in the 2nd round (Drafted over Michael Redd, Eddie House, Eduardo Najera, Brian Cardinal, Jabari Smith and Jason Hart all servicable and in some cases active players)

Wizards name Leonard Hamilton head coach (Bang)

1999-2000 Season Transactions

Wizards fire head coach Gar Heard and name Darrell Walker
interim head coach Case of jobs for the boys with Mr Walker getting his first coaching job after a stint with the Rockford Lightning of the CBA, later claim to fame was coaching the Washington WNBA franchise)

1999 -2000 Offseason Transactions

Wizards draft Richard Hamilton #7 in the 1st round and draft C Calvin Booth 35th overall in the 2nd round( Hamilton solid selection however still on the board at that time was Andre Miller, Shawn Marion, Jason Terry, Corey Magette, Ron Artest and Andrei Kirilenko...as for Booth he was taken over Manu Ginobili, Gordon Giricek, Francisco Elson, Lee Nailon and Rodney Buford who have all had moments of contribution and all slightly more then Booth)

Wizards trade 2001 2nd round pick to Orlando Magic for
SF/SG Laron Profit

Wizards trade PF/C Ben Wallace, PF Terry Davis, SG Tim Legler, and PG Jeff McGinnis to the Orlando Magic for C Ike Austin (In fairness to His Airness i suppose no one really knew how good a defensive player Wallace would, but old timer Davis and 3point bomber Legler were not major contributors at that point, but to a little over a season later move Austin out of town when his numbers had dropped little from when he was acquired form the Magic was amusing and still is amusing)

Wizards resign G Mitch Ricmond to four year, $40 million deal (Offering a $40 million dollar deal to a guy who was 34 or 35, perhaps slightly overpaid)



Anyways there is some bedtime reading for the masses, but i suppose in the eyes of Jordan23, the Holy Airness shall reign supreme whether he stunk it up or not...
 
I shall not bother to comment on the others firstly i can't bothered, secondly my wife-to-be are having one of our last weekends of serenity away from our kids and finally i think the point of the calibre of his front office skills is fairly well clarified.
 
Bulls talking deal to send Nocioni to Nets
According to league sources, the Chicago Bulls have discussed sending rugged forward Andres Nocioni and second-year guard Thabo Sefolosha to the Nets for Bostjan Nachbar, Marcus Williams, Antoine Wright and Jamaal Magloire. There might be other parts in the proposed deal.

The Bulls have been talking to several teams. Their first choice would be to use Nocioni in a package for Memphis Grizzlies big man Pau Gasol, but they're keeping their options open. The Nets were rebuffed in their advances for Gasol.

I know this is just a rumour but aside from acquiring a quality young point guard (which is a mute point considering they have two very good young PG's in Hinrich and Duhon), what do the Bulls gain from this deal?!?! It seems like doing a deal for the sake of doing a deal!

Both Sefalosha and Nocioni (particularly, the latter) are very promising players.
 
WOW how did I miss this thread, multiple page of off topic arguments.... classic

I think the bulls should go after JVG, sure he gives the same de-lama of not playing rookies but Noah and Grey are hustle player and he's a fan of that.
Their Defense needs fixing so he ticks the box there.

As for the low post presence they should try to pri Big Al from Minni, give Dang or Gordan + fillers.
 
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